Voyager - The Black Testament vs.Sephiroth & Dante

[Nikkolas]

Voyager, infamous mass murderer who, while human, killed men, women, children and fetuses has now become a Testament, a form of powerful being in Xenosaga. He takes on the villain of FFVII and Dante of Devil May Cry. They are allowed to give it everything they've got. No summoning Meteor, though. We don't want to halt the fight for seven days to see it do absolutely nothing to Voyager.

[Lord Sorgo]

Sephiroth casts Supernova while Dante executes Devil Trigger.


Voyager pwnt.

[Nikkolas]

Shame he teleports out of the way of both....or distorts space to rebound the attacks on them and they die horribly... I wouldn't recommend Dante try shooting Voyager because he'd just teleport all the bullets right into Dante's skull.

[Lord Sorgo]

Who says the UMN network will even apply to Sephiroth and Dante?

If it doesn't, that just makes him a cop that's good at programming.

Or Sephiroth casts stop and Voyager is dead in his tracks and left open for pwnage.

[Nikkolas]

Um, Voyager has nothing to do with the UMN... A Testament is a multi-dimensional being. They exist in imaginary space which Seph and the rest can't reach. What you see is Voyager allowing you to see. Your retinas register nothing because he's projecting himself and his image directly into your brain. So, like you'll see him, but a camera would see a blank spot where he is.

So, the UMN doesn't apply. And I doubt Sephiroth's magic will work on someone who can alter space-time anomalies. When you control space-time to annihilate bullets and eveyhing else shot at you, I'm pretty sure you can resist some tiny spell like Stop.

[Lord Sorgo]

Um, the UMN is the network that spans across the entire universe, and Erich's online alias was Voyager. He uses the UMN to perform cyberterrorism.

Stop making bullshit up, Nikkolas.

"Pretty sure" isn't good enough. Can you prove that he can stop a magic spell? And what stops Sephiroth from manipulating Voyagers mind through projection? Or why doesn't he just cast Ice3, Fire3, Quake3, Supernova, Stigma, Demi3 . . .

[Nikkolas]

Um, the UMN is the network that spans across the entire universe, and Erich's online alias was Voyager. He uses the UMN to perform cyberterrorism.

Stop making bullshit up, Nikkolas.

The hell? That's Voyager, the human. This is Voyager, the Testament. Voyager, the Testament, has nothing to do with the UMN. A Testament is in another dimension. It doesn't deal with the UMN at all save for Kevin's E.S. But, again, no, Voyager the Testament has nothing to do with the UMN.

"Pretty sure" isn't good enough. Can you prove that he can stop a magic spell? And what stops Sephiroth from manipulating Voyagers mind through projection? Or why doesn't he just cast Ice3, Fire3, Quake3, Supernova, Stigma, Demi3 . .

1. Voyager doesn't exist. His body isn't there. You can't put a Stop spell on something that only exists in your own mind. Hell, if I wanted, I could say Voyager doesn't let Sephiroth see him. As Testaments operate by projecting themselves into peoples' minds, he could just not do that and Sephiroth couldn't do anything. Testaments bend reality because they exist outside reality.
2. Sephiroth is gonna project mental images into a guy he can only see becausee that guy is projecting images into Sephiroth's mind...I don't think it will work.
3. And casting magic takes time. So..Voyager teleports out of the way of all of it.

[Lord Sorgo]

The hell? That's Voyager, the human. This is Voyager, the Testament. Voyager, the Testament, has nothing to do with the UMN. A Testament is in another dimension. It doesn't deal with the UMN at all save for Kevin's E.S. But, again, no, Voyager the Testament has nothing to do with the UMN.



1. Voyager doesn't exist. His body isn't there. You can't put a Stop spell on something that only exists in your own mind. Hell, if I wanted, I could say Voyager doesn't let Sephiroth see him. As Testaments operate by projecting themselves into peoples' minds, he could just not do that and Sephiroth couldn't do anything. Testaments bend reality because they exist outside reality.
2. Sephiroth is gonna project mental images into a guy he can only see becausee that guy is projecting images into Sephiroth's mind...I don't think it will work.
3. And casting magic takes time. So..Voyager teleports out of the way of all of it.

You make no sense whatsoever. It was only surreal and apparent in my mind, I could manipulate it to unexist. You do know that, right?

And they exist as Gnosis, which is a spiritual entity. Magic can be performed on Spiritual and realistically physical entities . . . So yes, Magic is accetable on Voyager because he still exists as an entity, even if he projects himself as a human.

"Erich is a complicated character to describe, because he actually has two personas—one is his "real" identity as Elrich, a member of the Federation police and talented programmer—and the other is his online identity as Voyager, a serial killer of unparalleled genius who preys on victims through the U.M.N.

Why can't Sephiroth project images into his head? What is stopping him from corrupting an entity as a whole?

And no, only certain magics take time. As an example, it took Sephiroth the wave of his hand on AC to cast DARKNESS among the skies. Sephiroth is a Demi God. He has the power to wave his hand to utilize Magic.

Erich can only kill through the UMN system. The UMN system is the guidance and control of all life throughout the XS universe, Nik.

How can you say the UMN automatically applies to Sephiroth with a lack of proof?

[Nikkolas]

You make no sense whatsoever. It was only surreal and apparent in my mind, I could manipulate it to unexist. You do know that, right?

No, you couldn't. Because you are bound by the laws of this world. You can't use the laws of a world and the physics of a world that a Testament exists outside of to hurt them.

And they exist as Gnosis, which is a spiritual entity. Magic can be performed on Spiritual and realistically physical entities . . . So yes, Magic is accetable on Voyager because he still exists as an entity, even if he projects himself as a human.

Virgil: "It's useless. The laws by which we are governed..are just too different."

And they aren't Gnosis. Gnosis retain no humanity or sense of self. The Testaments shed their flesh but are still quite in touch with who they were.

Why can't Sephiroth project images into his head? What is stopping him from corrupting an entity as a whole?

Because: a) he's not there. It's a projection into Sephiroth's mind. b) He's dead. His essense is in another dimension entirely.

And no, only certain magics take time. As an example, it took Sephiroth the wave of his hand on AC to cast DARKNESS among the skies. Sephiroth is a Demi God. He has the power to wave his hand to utilize Magic.

Nope. Wave of his hand equals more than enough time to teleport across the galaxy if Voyager wanted. "Wave hand and cast spell there. He's not there. He's behind you." Won't work.

Erich can only kill through the UMN system. The UMN system is the guidance and control of all life throughout the XS universe, Nik.

How can you say the UMN automatically applies to Sephiroth with a lack of proof?

Sorgo...you are making a complete fool of yourself. Voyager, the human, is dead The Voyager that killed through the UMN is not in this fight. This is Voyager the Testament. Voyager the Testament[.i] does not use the UMN to kill his victims. He uses the world around them which he can [i]control at his will. Understnad? Voyager the human died near the end of Pied Pier, 100 years before Xenosaga Episode I, and Wilhelm made him into a Testament. Thus, Voyage rno longer uses the UMN to kill people. Can you grasp this?

[Lord Sorgo]

No, you couldn't. Because you are bound by the laws of this world. You can't use the laws of a world and the physics of a world that a Testament exists outside of to hurt them.

I am? If he projects himself to exist SOLELY in my mind with a lack of personal entity outside of my cerebral area, then I can cease him to unexist ACCORDING to the Laws of Physics.

So he must have an entity outside of my head.



Virgil: "It's useless. The laws by which we are governed..are just too different."

And they aren't Gnosis. Gnosis retain no humanity or sense of self. The Testaments shed their flesh but are still quite in touch with who they were.

WTF? Gnosis in religion AND mythology are said to have held high status' of Knowledge beyond human comprehension.

If they exist as something unseen and they project themselves as an apparent form, they ARE Gnosis.




Originally Posted by Why can't Sephiroth project images into his head? What is stopping him from corrupting an entity as a whole?

Because: a) he's not there. It's a projection into Sephiroth's mind. b) He's dead. His essense is in another dimension entirely.
So? If he projects himself as an entity, he can be destroyed. He can be hit.

His entity is affected when damage to his external projection is given.


When they die, they enter the UMN. He went as Voyager. His projection and power and abilities have EVERYTHING to do with UMN.




Nope. Wave of his hand equals more than enough time to teleport across the galaxy if Voyager wanted. "Wave hand and cast spell there. He's not there. He's behind you." Won't work.

Like I said; Prove the UMN will apply to Sephiroth. If it does, then the Lifesteam and FF Uni works for Voyager, meaning Sephiroth holds the power to instantly manipulate Voyager, like he did with Cloud. And this is a fight, not a dance session. You can't say that Voyager can dodge Sephiroth forever. That's pathetic.

Then Sephiroth sits there and casts magic all day. You think Sephiroth won't know what's behind him? Once the projection is behind him, he flies and casts a spell.

And if Voyager goes behind Sephiroth, Sephiroth has Dante backing him up in this fight.

Dante shoots the Voyager or activates the Devils Trigger.


you are making a complete fool of yourself. Voyager, the human, is dead The Voyager that killed through the UMN is not in this fight. This is Voyager the Testament. Voyager [i]the Testament[.i] does not use the UMN to kill his victims. He uses the world around them which he can control at his will. Understnad? Voyager the human died near the end of Pied Pier, 100 years before Xenosaga Episode I, and Wilhelm made him into a Testament. Thus, Voyage rno longer uses the UMN to kill people. Can you grasp this?

ERICH (AKA, Voyager as a human, if you did not know) died. What happened?

"Erich allowed his body to die and entered the U.M.N."

Once he DIED, he entered the UMN eternally. Before, he was just entering it with his insane programming skills.

"Erich is a complicated character to describe, because he actually has two personas—one is his "real" identity as Elrich, a member of the Federation police and talented programmer—and the other is his online identity as Voyager, a serial killer of unparalleled genius who preys on victims through the U.M.N."

You're embarassing yourself now, Nikkolas. The world around everyone IS the freakin' UMN. Anyone inside would die, which was almost everybody.

The UMN is the source for matter itself throughout the Xenosaga. When he died, he was fully intergraded with the UMN. That's a fact.

[Nikkolas]

I am? If he projects himself to exist SOLELY in my mind with a lack of personal entity outside of my cerebral area, then I can cease him to unexist ACCORDING to the Laws of Physics.

So he must have an entity outside of my head.

He's in another dimension....Imaginary space which you can't penetrate.

WTF? Gnosis in religion AND mythology are said to have held high status' of Knowledge beyond human comprehension.

If they exist as something unseen and they project themselves as an apparent form, they ARE Gnosis.


The only thing Gnosis do is kill humans and destroy. They aren't intelligent beings from all I could see. They are the fomr of humans who have rejected the world. They display no levels of brain or intelligence or sense of self.

The Testaments are killed and then exist in imaginary space. So, no, Gnosis aren't made by people being killed and they aren't able to retain their humanity or brains. SO...nothing like the Testaments.



Re: Voyager - The Black Testament vs.Sephiroth & Dante
Originally Posted by
No, you couldn't. Because you are bound by the laws of this world. You can't use the laws of a world and the physics of a world that a Testament exists outside of to hurt them.

I am? If he projects himself to exist SOLELY in my mind with a lack of personal entity outside of my cerebral area, then I can cease him to unexist ACCORDING to the Laws of Physics.

So he must have an entity outside of my head.



Originally Posted by
Virgil: "It's useless. The laws by which we are governed..are just too different."

And they aren't Gnosis. Gnosis retain no humanity or sense of self. The Testaments shed their flesh but are still quite in touch with who they were.

WTF? Gnosis in religion AND mythology are said to have held high status' of Knowledge beyond human comprehension.

If they exist as something unseen and they project themselves as an apparent form, they ARE Gnosis.




Originally Posted by Why can't Sephiroth project images into his head? What is stopping him from corrupting an entity as a whole?

Originally Posted by
Because: a) he's not there. It's a projection into Sephiroth's mind. b) He's dead. His essense is in another dimension entirely.
So? If he projects himself as an entity, he can be destroyed. He can be hit.

His entity is affected when damage to his external projection is given.


When they die, they enter the UMN. He went as Voyager. His projection and power and abilities have EVERYTHING to do with UMN.

The only thing that ever killed the Testaments were themselves or an actual artifact inbued with the power of God himself. Voyager died that way. So, if being stabbed through the chest and shot at point-blank range by an E.S. does zero damage and the only thing capable of destroying him was a God item....

Like I said; Prove the UMN will apply to Sephiroth. If it does, then the Lifesteam and FF Uni works for Voyager, meaning Sephiroth holds the power to instantly manipulate Voyager, like he did with Cloud. And this is a fight, not a dance session. You can't say that Voyager can dodge Sephiroth forever. That's pathetic.

You don't know anything about the UMN...It's sad. The U.M.N. IS NOT how Voyager moves. He moves by bending reality. As he exists in imaginary space and projects himself into real space, he can move anywhere. It doesn't rely on the UMN. It relies on him. The UMN doesn't apply. What applies is his limitations which are non-existent given he exists in another dimension.

Dante shoots the Voyager or activates the Devils Trigger.

It's sad you don't know anything about what you're talking about. If you did, you might realize ullets do NOTHING to Voyager. And if Dante insists on shooting him...then Seph won't have Dnate backing him for long. All Voyager has to do is move every bullet shot at him right at Dante and there goes Dante.




Re: Voyager - The Black Testament vs.Sephiroth & Dante
Originally Posted by
No, you couldn't. Because you are bound by the laws of this world. You can't use the laws of a world and the physics of a world that a Testament exists outside of to hurt them.

I am? If he projects himself to exist SOLELY in my mind with a lack of personal entity outside of my cerebral area, then I can cease him to unexist ACCORDING to the Laws of Physics.

So he must have an entity outside of my head.



Originally Posted by
Virgil: "It's useless. The laws by which we are governed..are just too different."

And they aren't Gnosis. Gnosis retain no humanity or sense of self. The Testaments shed their flesh but are still quite in touch with who they were.

WTF? Gnosis in religion AND mythology are said to have held high status' of Knowledge beyond human comprehension.

If they exist as something unseen and they project themselves as an apparent form, they ARE Gnosis.




Originally Posted by Why can't Sephiroth project images into his head? What is stopping him from corrupting an entity as a whole?

Originally Posted by
Because: a) he's not there. It's a projection into Sephiroth's mind. b) He's dead. His essense is in another dimension entirely.
So? If he projects himself as an entity, he can be destroyed. He can be hit.

His entity is affected when damage to his external projection is given.


When they die, they enter the UMN. He went as Voyager. His projection and power and abilities have EVERYTHING to do with UMN.




Originally Posted by
Nope. Wave of his hand equals more than enough time to teleport across the galaxy if Voyager wanted. "Wave hand and cast spell there. He's not there. He's behind you." Won't work.

Like I said; Prove the UMN will apply to Sephiroth. If it does, then the Lifesteam and FF Uni works for Voyager, meaning Sephiroth holds the power to instantly manipulate Voyager, like he did with Cloud. And this is a fight, not a dance session. You can't say that Voyager can dodge Sephiroth forever. That's pathetic.

Then Sephiroth sits there and casts magic all day. You think Sephiroth won't know what's behind him? Once the projection is behind him, he flies and casts a spell.

And if Voyager goes behind Sephiroth, Sephiroth has Dante backing him up in this fight.

Dante shoots the Voyager or activates the Devils Trigger.


Originally Posted by
you are making a complete fool of yourself. Voyager, the human, is dead The Voyager that killed through the UMN is not in this fight. This is Voyager the Testament. Voyager the Testament[.i] does not use the UMN to kill his victims. He uses the world around them which he can control at his will. Understnad? Voyager the human died near the end of Pied Pier, 100 years before Xenosaga Episode I, and Wilhelm made him into a Testament. Thus, Voyage rno longer uses the UMN to kill people. Can you grasp this?

ERICH (AKA, Voyager as a human, if you did not know) died. What happened?

"Erich allowed his body to die and entered the U.M.N."

Once he DIED, he entered the UMN eternally. Before, he was just entering it with his insane programming skills.

"Erich is a complicated character to describe, because he actually has two personas—one is his "real" identity as Elrich, a member of the Federation police and talented programmer—and the other is his online identity as Voyager, a serial killer of unparalleled genius who preys on victims through the U.M.N."

You're embarassing yourself now, Nikkolas. The world around everyone IS the freakin' UMN. Anyone inside would die, which was almost everybody.

The UMN is the source for matter itself throughout the Xenosaga. When he died, he was fully intergraded with the UMN. That's a fact.

Well, to start off, I know more about Erich Weber than you do. I actually played the game. Erich Weber was born over 150 years before Pied Piper with a severe damage to his prefrontal cortex. To help sustain his being, he constructed working memory in the UMn and thus became an addict. Thirsty for the boundless knowledge of the net, he hacked to the UMN's very core and found U-DO. He was afraid...afraid of the end U-OD would bring and thus went out on a murdering spree. He assimilated the minds of his victims into himself, by offering them "eternal peace" in his mind where their souls and consciousnesses would stay.

Just a small history of him. Don't even question I know what I'm talking about.

When Voyager died, he did not enter the UMN. He enter imaginary space. Imaginary space is another dimension alongside our own. It's stated directly in the database on Episode III. Testaments exist in imaginary space, not the UMN. There were no mentions of any of the Testaments entering the UMn when they died anywhere in the database. That is official. You can't dispute official sources from the game. Sorry, but wiki won't cut it against official word.

You're embarassing yourself now, Nikkolas. The world around everyone IS the freakin' UMN. Anyone inside would die, which was almost everybody.

The UMN is the source for matter itself throughout the Xenosaga. When he died, he was fully intergraded with the UMN. That's a fact.

Yep..that's why the world and everyone still existed even when it vanished at the end of EPIII...

[Lord Sorgo]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



He's in another dimension....Imaginary space which you can't penetrate.

"Imaginary space"? Stop making shit up. His entity is able to be harmed, which was shown in the game. This means his surreal entity is able to obtain damage. It's that simple!


Originally Posted by WTF? Gnosis in religion AND mythology are said to have held high status' of Knowledge beyond human comprehension.

If they exist as something unseen and they project themselves as an apparent form, they ARE Gnosis.


The only thing Gnosis do is kill humans and destroy. They aren't intelligent beings from all I could see. They are the fomr of humans who have rejected the world. They display no levels of brain or intelligence or sense of self.

The Testaments are killed and then exist in imaginary space. So, no, Gnosis aren't made by people being killed and they aren't able to retain their humanity or brains. SO...nothing like the Testaments.

The Testament didn't reject the world? Voyager didn't kill humans and destroy?

Gnosis written all over it, hey? And yes, Gnosis happen to hold intelligence. That's just the history of it. You can just throw random figures around and expect them to be correct. Sorry, pal! Shit don't work that way.




The only thing that ever killed the Testaments were themselves or an actual artifact inbued with the power of God himself. Voyager died that way. So, if being stabbed through the chest and shot at point-blank range by an E.S. does zero damage and the only thing capable of destroying him was a God item....

Ziggy didn't have any imbued "God" artifacts or anything and he managed to stalemate in a battle with Voyager.


Oh, and . . .

"The Devil Trigger ability enables Dante to transform into the elemental devil infused in his weapon, changing his appearance, increasing his strength and defense, slowly restoring health, and enabling him to use special attacks available only during his demonic alter-ego."

^ Dante turns into a devil, and Sephiroth conforms into Safer Sephiroth.

They'd smash Voyager.


You don't know anything about the UMN...It's sad. The U.M.N. IS NOT how Voyager moves. He moves by bending reality. As he exists in imaginary space and projects himself into real space, he can move anywhere. It doesn't rely on the UMN. It relies on him. The UMN doesn't apply. What applies is his limitations which are non-existent given he exists in another dimension.

The UMN doesn't apply? You're directly lying to me. He used the UMN to kill innocents and others. When he died, he became Voyager eternally by intergrating himself within the UMN.

"Erich is a complicated character to describe, because he actually has two personas—one is his "real" identity as Elrich, a member of the Federation police and talented programmer—and the other is his online identity as Voyager, a serial killer of unparalleled genius who preys on victims through the U.M.N."

"Erich allowed his body to die and entered the U.M.N."


Are you not understanding it yet? Good lord.



It's sad you don't know anything about what you're talking about. If you did, you might realize ullets do NOTHING to Voyager. And if Dante insists on shooting him...then Seph won't have Dnate backing him for long. All Voyager has to do is move every bullet shot at him right at Dante and there goes Dante.

Dante turns into Devil Trigger and lobs fireballs at Voyager while Sephiroth casts magic uber quick.

He cannot stop everything, especially attacks from two Demi Gods.

Others were able to attack him with even so much as physical attacks. What stops them two from spells?





Well, to start off, I know more about Erich Weber than you do. I actually played the game. Erich Weber was born over 150 years before Pied Piper with a severe damage to his prefrontal cortex. To help sustain his being, he constructed working memory in the UMn and thus became an addict. Thirsty for the boundless knowledge of the net, he hacked to the UMN's very core and found U-DO. He was afraid...afraid of the end U-OD would bring and thus went out on a murdering spree. He assimilated the minds of his victims into himself, by offering them "eternal peace" in his mind where their souls and consciousnesses would stay.

Nice unsupported assumption. You know more than me? Why are you spewing off incorrect information? Why did you earlier refer to his human form as "Voyager"? Why are you saying he's immune to anything/everything if Ziggy was able to physically harm him and went so far as stalemating with him?

How did he do this? Why, he went through the DAMN UMN!!!


Just a small history of him. Don't even question I know what I'm talking about.

When Voyager died, he did not enter the UMN. He enter imaginary space. Imaginary space is another dimension alongside our own. It's stated directly in the database on Episode III. Testaments exist in imaginary space, not the UMN. There were no mentions of any of the Testaments entering the UMn when they died anywhere in the database. That is official. You can't dispute official sources from the game. Sorry, but wiki won't cut it against official word.

No, they entered the UMN when they died. The UMN *IS* space.

The UMN is the source for matter itself throughout the Xenosaga. When he died, he was fully intergraded with the UMN. That's a fact.

It is not material space, nor is it imaginary space. And It doesn't say it's imaginary space. Stop fucking lying! It's sort of a "Space in-between" both dimensions.

The quotes don't lie. I've played the game too. Stop making up your own facts as you go. That's a crap way to debate.



Yep..that's why the world and everyone still existed even when it vanished at the end of EPIII...

The UMN didn't vanish.

God, you don't know jackshit.

[Nikkolas]

Sigh..Sorgo. Testaments exist in imaginary space. You played Episode III? Did you beat it? Look at the database. It says under the entry for "Testament" that the Testaments exist in imaginary space. Not the UMN. Imaginary space. Another dimension. I'm sick of your bullshit. Imaginary space is where Voayger's body is. Not the UMN.

The UMN didn't vanish.

God, you don't know jackshit.

No, you didn't play the game. The UMN columns disappeared because the UMn was still there...that's brilliant!!!! God...shut up.

Voyager exists in another dimension. Not the UNN. And Voyager said this to Ziggy, dumbass.

"You should know by now it's impossible for you to harm me."

THis was after he took a full-blown blast from an E.S. with NO effect.

You can't kill a Testament. you can't hurt them. They're not physical beings. They are in imaginary space and interracting with the real space to alter it as they see fit. You can't hurt them. jesus Christ.

I'm done arguing with you till you play the game.

Voyager can't be harmed unless you can touch his body in imaginary space which neither Sephiroth nor Dante can do.

[Lord Sorgo]

Sigh..Sorgo. Testaments exist in imaginary space. You played Episode III? Did you beat it? Look at the database. It says under the entry for "Testament" that the Testaments exist in imaginary space. Not the UMN. Imaginary space. Another dimension. I'm sick of your bullshit. Imaginary space is where Voayger's body is. Not the UMN.

God, you don't know jackshit.

No, you didn't play the game. The UMN columns disappeared because the UMn was still there...that's brilliant!!!! God...shut up.

Voyager exists in another dimension. Not the UNN. And Voyager said this to Ziggy, dumbass.

"You should know by now it's impossible for you to harm me."

THis was after he took a full-blown blast from an E.S. with NO effect.

You can't kill a Testament. you can't hurt them. They're not physical beings. They are in imaginary space and interracting with the real space to alter it as they see fit. You can't hurt them. jesus Christ.

I'm done arguing with you till you play the game.

So, the ES and Sephiroth's magic AND Dante's spells are parallel? How the hell are you going to prove that they cannot do harm when Voyagers entity only existed in the UMN?

Here, read once again, kay?

"Erich is a complicated character to describe, because he actually has two personas—one is his "real" identity as Elrich, a member of the Federation police and talented programmer—and the other is his online identity as Voyager, a serial killer of unparalleled genius who preys on victims through the U.M.N."

^ Read it, please. He only existed as Voyager through the UMN. Outside of that, he was a fucking twenty eight year old police officer.

And Ziggy + Voyager fought on par, and it ended in a stalemate. Voyager couldn't destroy Ziggy, and Ziggy could not kill the Voyager.

"Another side effect of Erich's genetic manipulation is that he has a congenital brain disorder, which he controls by constructing working memory inside of the U.M.N. This is how he developed such an intense affinity with the network. He became addicted to information and dove deeper and deeper, trying to find what was at the centre of the U.M.N. What he encountered was U-DO, which tormented him and drove him to become "Voyager"—a position that was originally occupied by Yuriev, who had a similar encounter with U-DO.

As Voyager, Erich kills many people, including Mikhail, Jan's wife, Sharon Rozas, and his stepson, Joaquin Rozas. Bugs later commits suicide after discovering the truth about him.

After Yuriev stopped delivering the drug to him, Erich allowed his body to die and entered the U.M.N."

Read it, dude. When he died, he fully entered the UMN as the Voyager.

And Voyager saying that was in their first battle.

Their final battle in the Archon Cathedral ended with a complete stalemate. Same with their first battle.

And that's at the end when the UMN ends, when Canaan takes Voyager down with himself.

They both fall victim to it. It seems you know nothing of what you speak.