Kadaj Vs. Loz and Yazoo

[Kadaj]

I definatly think that Kadaj could beat both alone, but how about together... "as a family"?

[Veneficus]

I definatly think that Kadaj could beat both alone, but how about together... "as a family"?
Loz brings in with the superspeed and phasing, while Yazoo rains down bullets upon Kadaj and the duo win.

And you have a frightenly serious obsession with AC...

[Kadaj]

sorry... I just liked that movie... A LOT! I must have watched it... like... infinity times...

[Veneficus]

sorry... I just liked that movie... A LOT! I must have watched it... like... infinity times...

I bought the English version when It came out... watched it twice and than forgot about it. It currently sits collecting dust with the rest of my dvds.

[Lord Sorgo]

Kadaj defeats both of them.

[Kadaj]

I think Kadaj could... he did hold his own against Cloud... he lost, along with Sephiroth, when Sephiroth made a bad move and got caught by Cloud's Omni-slash... oh and by the way... I have heard that you guys believe Sephiroth let Cloud Omni-slash him... that is bunk... As Cloud lunges at Sephiroth, Cloud makes a move that looks like he's going to attack, but instead throws his sword, almost hitting Sephiroth and flying past his face, attracting his attention... Cloud uses this moment of distraction to begin his attack, and once it starts, it doesn't stop... Besides, Sephiroth wasn't truly defeated... he acknowledged his failure and made a strategic withdrawal...

[Lord Sorgo]

Kadaj, you do know that Sephiroth could have killed Cloud, right?

You notice how he was throwing Cloud around like a rag doll and was kicking the ever-living shit out of him?

And then Sephiroth stabbed Cloud in the Arm. He could have stabbed him in the face and ended it right there.

Sephiroth gave Cloud a second chance to attack. That was his only mistake. Sephiroth had Cloud's ass, through and through.

[Traya]

Yeah. We see Sephiroth collapse buildings, and tool Cloud with his sword.

[Lord Sorgo]

Exactly. Sephiroth has the upper hand for most of the fight.

[Motoko]

I agree, Sephiroth had the major dominance on the fight (as Sorgo pointed out, he could've killed Cloud when he stabbed him through the arm), and I'm fairly certain the Reunion Files state that Sephiroth had Cloud "outmatched".

[sith'ari]

I'd agree that Sephiroth had him completely outmatched and could have killed him, but I don't see why he would let Cloud Omni-slash him.

[Lord Sorgo]

I agree, Sephiroth had the major dominance on the fight (as Sorgo pointed out, he could've killed Cloud when he stabbed him through the arm), and I'm fairly certain the Reunion Files state that Sephiroth had Cloud "outmatched".

Omg . . . Motoko...

You're here.

[Nikkolas]

Yes...yes, he did have the upper-hand for most of the fight. Like Bower had the upper-hand in Super Mario Bros. 1, Super Mario Brothers 3, Super Mario World, Super Mario 64... Unfortunately for Seph, he's not nearly as cool as Bowser and he hasn't lost enough to be commended for his dedication but simply ridiculed for his lack of intelligence. He could have killed Cloud is good and all but at the end of the day, he lost. Good SW analogy is Maul and Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan walked away from the fight and Maul was sliced in half. Obi-Wan wins.

[Lord Sorgo]

There's an explanation for that; Kenobi let his rage go loose and dominate Maul because Kenobi was the greater duelist. It's that simple.

Sephiroth could have killed Cloud. He had the opportunity. He BESTED him.

But . . . The bad guys never win.

[Nikkolas]

Most times because they are stupid. Sephiroth being a key example. I'm still waiting for him to show me exactly what makes him so great to so many people. He hasn't caused 10% the havoc of other lesser known villains. He isn't as powerful as lesser-known villains. And yes, I do not like him.

[Lord Sorgo]

Sephiroth is actually arguably one of the most powerful Final Fantasy Villains out there. That's why I like him so much.

[Nikkolas]

Eh? Neo-ExDeath anyone with the Void? Kuja, blows up planets? Kefka becoming a god? If you say so.

[Lord Sorgo]

Kefka was a Demi-god, like Sephiroth.

Sephiroth:

- Was a Demi God.
- Was Physically undestroyable by any means.
- Blew up HUNDREDS of planets and stars via Supernova.
- Knew almost every magical spell.
- Was able to teleport anywhere he pleased.
- Could go into heaven whenever he wanted to.
- Was an expert duelist with a sword.
- Could cast spells of terrible power with the flick of his wrist.

[Nikkolas]

- Was a Demi God.

Oh. i see. That's why he needed the energy of Northern Crater to summon Meteor. Come on. It was plainly stated that not Sephiroth nor anyone else could summon Meteor on theri own.

- Was Physically undestroyable by any means.

That would be why he was destroyed at the end of FFVII and the end of AC? his consciousness had split into the Silver-Haired Men after his BODY was destroyed because he DIED. Once he takes bullets to the head and full-on impaling and doesn't blink, then that statement is true.

- Blew up HUNDREDS of planets and stars via Supernova.

You do realize that's not a real attack? It's an in-battle cinematic with no bearing on the story. If Cloud and the group can survive a "supernova" then god knows any number of beings can. Haven't you seen flashy parts in a battle where large chunks of land are destroyed? Yet, after that's over, they return. They are not really destroying large bits of land. They are simply performing an in-battle move that has no bearing on the world of the game.

- Knew almost every magical spell.

He knew Shadow Flare, Demi3 is pretty much it. pale horse, Stigma, and most other moves he uses in Bizarro and Safer Sephiroth forms are unique techniques like most bosses have.

- Was able to teleport anywhere he pleased.

Funny. I remember his body being stuck in Northern Crater and him using the Jenova cells in the clones to make them appear like him or Jenova's body to look like him or simply astral projections. No one is certain, as far as I know, of which is which in each encounter. If he teleports to anywhere in AC, then maybe he can. I havent' seen the whole movie. Just know the facts.

- Could go into heaven whenever he wanted to.

You're kidding, right...? That was a backdrop to the fight. Aeris herself said there is no Heaven, basically. The soul does not ascend to Heaven in FFVII. It becomes a part of the Planet. It's in a discussion Elmyra has with a young girl Aeris.

- Was an expert duelist with a sword.

A completely oversized sword and yes he can fight with it. That doesn't make him great...

Could cast spells of terrible power with the flick of his wrist.

And it really took Kefka hours and hours to fire up the Light of Judgment to wipe out whole cities, I suppose? Or Kuja hours and hours to destroy Terra? Didn't think so.

Sephiroth is nothing special.

[Lord Sorgo]

Oh. i see. That's why he needed the energy of Northern Crater to summon Meteor. Come on. It was plainly stated that not Sephiroth nor anyone else could summon Meteor on theri own.

What the hell are you talking about? Sephiroth was able to generate Meteor out of his own power. The Northern Crater was used to aid in it being more powerful and to ressurect Jenova.


That would be why he was destroyed at the end of FFVII and the end of AC? his consciousness had split into the Silver-Haired Men after his BODY was destroyed because he DIED. Once he takes bullets to the head and full-on impaling and doesn't blink, then that statement is true.

Um . . .

At the final point, they were fighting him in his state of mind, not his physical body, Nik. He could NOT be physically destroyed.

Or if he takes more than ten swords slashes and has no visible marks on his body like in AC.

Statement is true. Period.

You do realize that's not a real attack? It's an in-battle cinematic with no bearing on the story. If Cloud and the group can survive a "supernova" then god knows any number of beings can. Haven't you seen flashy parts in a battle where large chunks of land are destroyed? Yet, after that's over, they return. They are not really destroying large bits of land. They are simply performing an in-battle move that has no bearing on the world of the game.

They survived it? Last time I checked, It wasn't performed on them. The Supernova was casted by Sephiroth and it instantly wiped out over a dozen planets and this attack was purely from Sephiroth's power.


He knew Shadow Flare, Demi3 is pretty much it. pale horse, Stigma, and most other moves he uses in Bizarro and Safer Sephiroth forms are unique techniques like most bosses have.

Havoc Wing
Pale Horse
Deen
DeBarrier
DeSpell
Demi3
Break
Wall
Shadow Flare
Super Nova
Fire3
Stigma
Heartless Angel
Ice3

^ Yeah, nice try naming three spells and all, Nik.


Funny. I remember his body being stuck in Northern Crater and him using the Jenova cells in the clones to make them appear like him or Jenova's body to look like him or simply astral projections. No one is certain, as far as I know, of which is which in each encounter. If he teleports to anywhere in AC, then maybe he can. I havent' seen the whole movie. Just know the facts.

Astral projections? He had utilized Teleportation previously, and it also used it again to teleport DIRECTLY into heaven and into a differential realm. Was THAT a projection?


You're kidding, right...? That was a backdrop to the fight. Aeris herself said there is no Heaven, basically. The soul does not ascend to Heaven in FFVII. It becomes a part of the Planet. It's in a discussion Elmyra has with a young girl Aeris.

Or sorry, not heaven, but the realm where souls exist or something. He teleports them all there. It wasn't just a backdrop for a fight. That's damn stupid. Did Sephiroth walk up to a piece of cardboard and stand it up, or what?


A completely oversized sword and yes he can fight with it. That doesn't make him great...

If he's unkillable, yes it does.

And it really took Kefka hours and hours to fire up the Light of Judgment to wipe out whole cities, I suppose? Or Kuja hours and hours to destroy Terra? Didn't think so.

Actually, It did take Kefka hours to prepare the Light of Judgment.

Kuja destroyed a single planet. Whoop-dee-do!

[Nikkolas]

What the hell are you talking about? Sephiroth was able to generate Meteor out of his own power. The Northern Crater was used to aid in it being more powerful and to ressurect Jenova.

Glad you know better than the game....

Cloud picked up the Black Materia.

Cloud: Mmm? Can you guys use it?

Aerith: Nope, we can't use it right now. You need great spiritual power to use it.

Cloud: You mean lots of Spiritual energy?

Aerith: That's right. One person's power alone won't do it. Somewhere special. Where there's plenty of the Planet's energy... Oh yeah! The Promised Land!!

Um . . .

At the final point, they were fighting him in his state of mind, not his physical body, Nik. He could NOT be physically destroyed.

Only the fight between Cloud and Seph was mental. The rest was reality. They destroyed Sephiroth’s body.



Originally Posted by
You do realize that's not a real attack? It's an in-battle cinematic with no bearing on the story. If Cloud and the group can survive a "supernova" then god knows any number of beings can. Haven't you seen flashy parts in a battle where large chunks of land are destroyed? Yet, after that's over, they return. They are not really destroying large bits of land. They are simply performing an in-battle move that has no bearing on the world of the game.

They survived it? Last time I checked, It wasn't performed on them. The Supernova was casted by Sephiroth and it instantly wiped out over a dozen planets and this attack was purely from Sephiroth's power.

..don’t be stupid, dude. You do realize that the ENTIRE SOLAR SYSTEM is remade for the move? It DOES NOT destroy the solar system. It’s an ATTACK on the party and that’s why it LOWERS HP. You understand that? Sephiroth can not destroy, remake, destroy, remake, destroy, remake the solar system. Honestly. Get a grip.


Originally Posted by
He knew Shadow Flare, Demi3 is pretty much it. pale horse, Stigma, and most other moves he uses in Bizarro and Safer Sephiroth forms are unique techniques like most bosses have.

Havoc Wing
Pale Horse
Deen
DeBarrier
DeSpell
Demi3
Break
Wall
Shadow Flare
Super Nova
Fire3
Stigma
Heartless Angel
Ice3

^ Yeah, nice try naming three spells and all, Nik.[.quote]

Yep. So, as I said genius, most of his moves are unique attacks which all bosses get. So, my point is valid. Hell, one member of the party can know more magic than Sephiroth.

[quote]Astral projections? He had utilized Teleportation previously, and it also used it again to teleport DIRECTLY into heaven and into a differential realm. Was THAT a projection?

It’s NOT HIM. NOT him. His body is in Northern Crater.

Or sorry, not heaven, but the realm where souls exist or something. He teleports them all there. It wasn't just a backdrop for a fight. That's damn stupid. Did Sephiroth walk up to a piece of cardboard and stand it up, or what?

Here’s an ingenious question then - why after he is destroyed does the entire party just poof back to where they started?

Kuja destroyed a single planet. Whoop-dee-do!

Sephiroth needed Meteor to even inflict major damage on a signel planet. A mateira anyone can use. Kuja used his own power (augmented own power but still) to destroy Terra. Sephiroth failed to even use Meteor to effectively wound the planet!

[Lord Sorgo]

Glad you know better than the game....

Cloud picked up the Black Materia.

Cloud: Mmm? Can you guys use it?

Aerith: Nope, we can't use it right now. You need great spiritual power to use it.

Cloud: You mean lots of Spiritual energy?

Aerith: That's right. One person's power alone won't do it. Somewhere special. Where there's plenty of the Planet's energy... Oh yeah! The Promised Land!!

You DO know Sephiroth controls those dark energies, right?

Have you seen AC? He waves his hand and the darkness overcomes the entire area. He is capable of casting Meteor without assistance of the Crater.

Oh I see . . . So, Cloud and Aerith couldn't use the Balck Materia . . . So Sephiroth couldn't? Lol. Funny shit there.

Um . . .

At the final point, they were fighting him in his state of mind, not his physical body, Nik. He could NOT be physically destroyed.

Only the fight between Cloud and Seph was mental. The rest was reality. They destroyed Sephiroth’s body.

Yes, but his physical body could warrant return. He was capable of coming back. That's the point. Even after his spiritual entity was destroyed, he STILL fucking returned. He cannot be destroyed. Do you understand that?

He couldn't on FFVII, and he couldn't on AC.


..don’t be stupid, dude. You do realize that the ENTIRE SOLAR SYSTEM is remade for the move? It DOES NOT destroy the solar system. It’s an ATTACK on the party and that’s why it LOWERS HP. You understand that? Sephiroth can not destroy, remake, destroy, remake, destroy, remake the solar system. Honestly. Get a grip.

REALLY?

Video of Supernova tearing through planets, eating stars and ripping asteroids to shreds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gx7_TnFG9Hc

See how much damage it does? OVER A DAMN TRILLION, NIK!


LOL, In the end of the video, it hits the Sun and fusions with it, causing it to grow to larger sizes as it eats planets.

Hell, IT GOES RIGHT THROUGH SEPHIROTH AND DOES NOTHING.

The attack is pathetically powerful.



Supernova is a manifestation of an actual Sun, and several hundred bolts and shockwaves. It's capability could destroy planets and asteroids. And Sephiroth did not even need materia to summon this magic either.



Yep. So, as I said genius, most of his moves are unique attacks which all bosses get. So, my point is valid. Hell, one member of the party can know more magic than Sephiroth.

Most bosses get his powers?

Would you like me to list all the bosses of that game and their powers? Nothing comes near as powerful, Nik.


It’s NOT HIM. NOT him. His body is in Northern Crater.

He teleported the entire party into a sort of "Astral plane", so to say, while fighting them.

He took them to the core of the planet. It wasn't an illusion.




Here’s an ingenious question then - why after he is destroyed does the entire party just poof back to where they started?

Because his teleportation capabilities are basically ended when he is destroyed. He no longer possesses the power to keep them in that specific plane (Core of the planet)

But the fact is, he took them there. Sephiroth dissipated there.


Sephiroth needed Meteor to even inflict major damage on a signel planet. A mateira anyone can use. Kuja used his own power (augmented own power but still) to destroy Terra. Sephiroth failed to even use Meteor to effectively wound the planet!

Kuja didn't even make the planet dissipate, niether did he destroy it. He carpet sweeped it with Ultima and left it in ruin.

BTW, Sephiroth was STOPPED from destroying the planet. You don't think he could have if not stopped by an entire party of warriors?

Please.

[Nikkolas]

Oh I see . . . So, Cloud and Aerith couldn't use the Balck Materia . . . So Sephiroth couldn't? Lol. Funny shit there.

Dude...ONE PERSON. No one person. Not "only us persons" No one person. Not Sephiroth, not anyone. Whoever needs it needs the power of the Planet's life energy which Sephiroth had as he was in northern Crater.

Yes, but his physical body could warrant return. He was capable of coming back. That's the point. Even after his spiritual entity was destroyed, he STILL fucking returned. He cannot be destroyed. Do you understand that?

He couldn't on FFVII, and he couldn't on AC.

Until he comes back in another game, he's destroyed.

REALLY?

Video of Supernova tearing through planets, eating stars and ripping asteroids to shreds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gx7_TnFG9Hc

See how much damage it does? OVER A DAMN TRILLION, NIK!


LOL, In the end of the video, it hits the Sun and fusions with it, causing it to grow to larger sizes as it eats planets.

Hell, IT GOES RIGHT THROUGH SEPHIROTH AND DOES NOTHING.

The attack is pathetically powerful.



Supernova is a manifestation of an actual Sun, and several hundred bolts and shockwaves. It's capability could destroy planets and asteroids. And Sephiroth did not even need materia to summon this magic either.

And summons in other games vaporize entire pieces of the Earth. THen, after that is done, the ground destroyed comes back. So, again, it's just a flashy move that can't kill the party. It can't kill other FF villains.

Would you like me to list all the bosses of that game and their powers? Nothing comes near as powerful, Nik.

I said unique powers. Unique attacks only they can do. Examples: Kuja can use Holy which is magic the party knows. He also uses Flare Star, which they can't use.

Kuja didn't even make the planet dissipate, niether did he destroy it. He carpet sweeped it with Ultima and left it in ruin.

Mikoto: Terra will soon be gone.
Mikoto: Kuja destroyed a palnet.

So, yes, he blew up the planet. We didn't see it because well...they were trying to escape and couldn't watch him.

BTW, Sephiroth was STOPPED from destroying the planet. You don't think he could have if not stopped by an entire party of warriors?

Please.

The warriors who were stopping Kuja gave him the power to destroy a planet. THis group only managed to stop him from destroying all existence by dying (his Ultima and then they're in some sort of hell dimension and only can fight by sacrificing their power) so...he wins.

[Lord Sorgo]

Dude...ONE PERSON. No one person. Not "only us persons" No one person. Not Sephiroth, not anyone. Whoever needs it needs the power of the Planet's life energy which Sephiroth had as he was in northern Crater.

Meteor can arguably be used by an entity because it has been previously.

Where do they mention that he needed the Northern Cave to utilize Meteor? He needed the Materia, not the area.


Until he comes back in another game, he's destroyed.

He came back in AC and he even revived in the middle of FFVII. He's undestroyable.

And summons in other games vaporize entire pieces of the Earth. THen, after that is done, the ground destroyed comes back. So, again, it's just a flashy move that can't kill the party. It can't kill other FF villains.

Summons? What summons? Did they completely destroy earth and everything surrounding it like Sephiroth's did?

And it CAN kill the party. You see how fast they had to heal? Their party was dealt over a trillion damage.

It can't kill other FF Villains? Fucking prove up.

Originally Posted by
Would you like me to list all the bosses of that game and their powers? Nothing comes near as powerful, Nik.

I said unique powers. Unique attacks only they can do. Examples: Kuja can use Holy which is magic the party knows. He also uses Flare Star, which they can't use.

Okay, so what is him having unique powers relevant to, exactly?

This doesn't change the fact that he has the most powerful powers and a large number of them, which is what you refuted when you named three powers. HELLO!



Mikoto: Terra will soon be gone.
Mikoto: Kuja destroyed a palnet.

So, yes, he blew up the planet. We didn't see it because well...they were trying to escape and couldn't watch him.

No, he did not blow it up. He left it in ruins.

"Kuja used his powers to coldly destroy Terra, and reduced it to a state of utter ruin."

How could it be in a state of ruin if it was "Blown up"?

He didn't even blow it up. Didn't hold the power to.


The warriors who were stopping Kuja gave him the power to destroy a planet. THis group only managed to stop him from destroying all existence by dying (his Ultima and then they're in some sort of hell dimension and only can fight by sacrificing their power) so...he wins.

Kuja's power generated from him nearly being defeated. Kuja went nuts and tried to bring everything down with him because he knew he wasn't powerful enough to succeed with his plans.

Kuja was never as powerful as the party. He brought them down with him from seeing this cold realization.

"Even with all the power Kuja had acquired he still could not withstand Zidane and his team."

[Kadaj]

Kadaj, you do know that Sephiroth could have killed Cloud, right?

You notice how he was throwing Cloud around like a rag doll and was kicking the ever-living shit out of him?

And then Sephiroth stabbed Cloud in the Arm. He could have stabbed him in the face and ended it right there.

Sephiroth gave Cloud a second chance to attack. That was his only mistake. Sephiroth had Cloud's ass, through and through.
exactly my point... Sephiroth didn't let him do it, he made a mistake...

[Lord Sorgo]

His only mistake was throwing that sword into his arm instead of his heart.

He then dodged Clouds next attack and took that Omnislash like a man!

Lol, And Cloud's most powerful attack still did nothing. Hah.

[Kadaj]

True, Sephiroth just laughed at it really... then he made a strategic withdrawal...

[Lord Sorgo]

True enough.

I mean, let's face it; Sephiroth made Cloud look like a straight up bitch during that duel.

[Kadaj]

anyone who objects will have their logic shot down... FEAR ME!... and Sorgo too, I guess...

[Lord Sorgo]

Everyone has their fucked up side of Logic and their good sides, I guess.